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On Birfers and Truthers
February 12, 2010
I see that Erick Erickson of RedState has made it clear that RedState is not the place for birfers or truthers. Neither is American Majority. I second Erick’s comments that birfers and truthers have no place among us, nor do they have a place in the tea party movement. Birfers and Truthers are free to enjoy their freedom of speech rights: every American has that right. But to them I say, “Have fun with your freedom of speech in the political wilderness.” Those of us who are serious about positive change in this country have far more important issues to deal with, and we are adamantly opposed to you being associated in any way with the tea party movement.
You didn’t directly address Debra Medina, but she’s not a “truther”. Debra Medina has never said that she thinks the government was behind
9/11. In fact she has emphatically denounced that belief.
There is a lot of sensationalize of this issue that is precluding rational debate. People are using the fallacy of the excluded middle to immediately force everyone into one of two camps: you either believe the government 100% or else you obviously believe in every insane conspiracy.
There’s no room for people who don’t believe in a conspiracy and yet wonder why parts of the 9/11 Commission report are still classified. We have been told that the government could have prevented the attack based on information they had but didn’t due to negligence and incompetence. Is it wrong to think that maybe they is even more negligence and incompetence than we are aware of? How many of the problems that allowed the last attacks to happen have been fixed and how many have not been fixed? Are these questions outside the bounds of reasonable inquiry?
Debra Medina is not a professional politician – that’s why we support her. Like many of us she doesn’t think that we know the whole story, but since it isn’t relevant to the future of the state of Texas she wasn’t fully prepared to address the question as smoothly as politician might.
If you want a more thoughtful analysis of her response to Glenn Beck then you should read this piece by David Jennings:
Beck’s small-minded ploy at Medina is backfiring, to the tune of $50k influx of fundraising just raised for her in the past day or so. Epic FAIL.
Nice redesign and a hearty Huzzah! to the banning of birfers and trufers 🙂 See you tomorrow
Jack, I give you this clip:
https://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0210/From_911_to_the_birth_certificate.html?showall
And really, when asked by Beck if it’s an inside job or not, there is no nuance to it: it’s either yes or no.
That’s peanuts compared to what Rubio raised the other day, and I am willing to go out on a limb and say Medina gets single digits in the primary.
Ethan, thanks. See you tomorrow.
I was lukewarm on Medina, but when she declined to give a definitive answer to Glenn’s question I went off her completely. He was quite fair and gave her several opportunities to clarify her comments. It is one thing to want to be all inclusive and respect everyone’s views but it is quite another not to be able to state with certainty that which she believes – or now says she believes.
A recent survey shows that a smaller percentage of California residents identify with the Tea Party movement than have questions about Obama’s citizenship:
https://www.field.com/fieldpollonline/subscribers/Rls2325.pdf
I’m guessing there’s a sizable overlap of those two groups also. If you want to completely ostracize at least 1/3 of the population, at least don’t pretend this is somehow going to benefit the movement.
[…] Tea Party platform. This isn’t an issue that can help us win in November, and it’s not the hill I want the movement to die […]
Maybe he’s not a legal citizen…maybe the government blew up the twin towers…you know what opinions are like….everyone’s got one. I get so frustrated with these issues that mean nothing in the big picture. Quite frankly, unless someone can come up with concrete evidence on either subject, there’s no reason to discuss it. We have a country to try to salvage before the liberal agenda destroys it completely. If sometime in the future we have the spare time to ponder such questions, that’ll be fine, but for now, I agree…no birthers, no truthers. Just gives the MSM fodder to try to discredit us.
Now that we know how you really feel, let’s see what your members think of this.
“…we are adamantly opposed to you being associated in any way…”
My days of recommending American Majority as a resource are over. I’m a birther and truther. I have never advocated for these things when I attend or recommend American Majority. I had no idea that American Majority was filled with people who always believe the official story? I thought a lot of us question what the Government does or has said?
I understand the need to stand united on common, relevant issues. I understand the need to avoid divisive issues.
What I don’t understand is why you would strike out like this against your members.
I hope you know a good deal of the people in Oklahoma, and in turn your Oklahoma chapter are “birthers”.
I don’t know about single digits. She got to 24% in the face of constant media stories saying that she had no chance at all. Who can say how many will listen to the attacks going on right now and how many will ignore them?
The fact that you want to crucify her based on a few carefully chosen soundbites instead of addressing her positions in their entirety says more about you and your organization than it says about her.
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This post was mentioned on Twitter by AmericaMajority: AM’s Blog: On Birfers and #Truthers https://goo.gl/fb/axbn #featurecontent #birthers #conservativeleaders #news…
A. I doubt I will alienate a 1/3 of the population on these issues.
B. Medina showed she’s hardly ready for city council, much less the U.S. Senate, with her inability to be concise on such an easy question.
C. I really doubt most of the people in OK are birthers and truthers. You should call a conference sometime. I doubt it would be a significant gathering.
D. At the end of the day, what do birthers really hope to accomplish? And don’t give me, We want to defend the Constitution. You want Obama removed from office? So you can get Biden? Or if you remove that Presidential ticket, Pelosi? And truthers: you honestly think that our government plowed planes into the World Trade Centers? I can’t have a rational conversation with people who actually think that.
FYI, meant Governor, not U.S. Senate, in my previous comment, but Medina’s not ready for any elected office. Period.
I believe that Obama was born in Hawaii. But a Hawaiian-born Obama would still NOT be a natural born citizen because his father (Obama Senior) was not a US citizen. A natural born citizen is a person born in the United States AND born to citizen parents(plural). The US Supreme Court defined the term this way in the 1874 case of Minor v. Happersett.
Thank you. It’s this sort of idiotic borderline hysteria that an eager media seizes upon to portray all of us as unhinged, hateful morons.
Excellent Comment TexomaEd
Being ineligible, in Obama’s case has nothing to do with ‘birther’, it’s a Constitutional issue. Our Constitution defines who is eligible. The DNC was questioned when it was announced that Obama would be a candidate, before he and Hillary hashed it out in the Democrat race.
Perhaps those at AmericanMajority & RedState should research Bill S.2678 & ask yourself why this took place. Why was an issue made of McCains eligibility & not Obama’s? Further more, according to the Constitution, Hillary is ineligible for the Position she is in.
I do agree, there are variations of opinions as to where he was born & the MSM exaggerates and remains focused on anything negative or ‘way out there’, but why squelch free speech & free thinking – this could cause more harm than good.
Again, this is not a ‘birther’ issue – it’s Constitutional. Per Obama – his father was not a US citizen, further more Obama stated he retained dual citizenship = our Constitution defines that as being ineligible for POTUS due to divided allegiance.
Not that the hypnotized will see the light, but here it is pretty succinct and straightforward: https://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/citizen.asp
Patrick,
Your link is to a site that is all about where Obama was born and/or the age of his mother, and not about the fact that his father was not a US citizen. That fact ALONE makes Obama not a natural born citizen, because being born in Hawaii is not enough — both of his parents had to be US citizens at the time of his birth.
The US Supreme Court, in the 1874 case of Minor v. Happersett, said the following: “At common law, with the nomenclature of which the framers of the constitution were familiar, it was never doubted that all children born in a country, of parents who were its citizens, became themselves, upon their birth, citizens also. These were natives or natural-born citizens, as distinguished from aliens or foreigners.”
Now, exactly who is it that is hypnotized?
After two days of trying to put my feelings into coherent words, I think I have finally worked it out.
You yourself said that Birtherism has nothing to do with the Tea Party movement. So why are you making it the number one issue?
I agree with everything that I believed the Tea Party stood for: smaller government, less taxes and upholding the Constitution. And yet you are willing to exclude me, based on what we both agree is a totally unrelated opinion that I hold?
I am with you Robert Kessler. It just proves to me they are only worried about one thing. And that is winning the same old game of R & D. They don’t care about the truth on anything. Only what benefits them for the sake of winning.
Its a shame to waste your talents Ned and yet remain so ignorant. Someday maybe you will wake up along with the other misguided people here?
First, let me say this, this current Socialist Marxist Regime is no government. They show you what their left hand while they try to pull something off with their right. Who cares where he was born, while all you are focusing on his birth certificate, KSM, Gitmo, Crap and Trade. They are trying to bankrupt the middle class. They can’t come out and say you are a mechanic, this is what you should make, thats Socialism. Instead, they want the middle class to be taxed, so they can still control what you put in your pocket. Why, because the middle class has money to support their politicians. This is what Health Care is about, so they can tax 270 million of the middle class to pay for Health Care for 30 million. You see, first it was Stimulus, then Health Care, Crap and Trade, if left don’t get you, the right will. And as for Medina, I will vote for her, she doesn’t have to know everything, that’s why you have people to advise her, she just has to do what the people of the state of Texas want her to do. And the issue with Beck asking her that question, he got something out of doing it from someone. But he has lost alot of viewers because of his now questionable behavior.
The birfers howling in these comments provide exquisite proof of the point of the article.
You’re all nuts. Whatever you think of the man, Barack Obama is the duly elected president of the United States, and it is an American patriot’s obligation to respect the office. If you don’t, you’re a traitor.
To mock the Birthers is like taking the foundation out from under a building. To deny the peoples right to ask a simple question about Obamas birth and get a legitimate answer. Not the BS the white house put on the internet as Obamas birth certificate. Without the birthers you would not have as large a tea party. Who do you think started asking questions first? You can reject the birthers like the main street media does and call them names. Why has Obama spent so much money 1.7 million dollars to keep his past secret? If you really check the story out you my change your mind on the birth certificate. Or believe the bs the news media puts out and call us loons like the media does. Just show us a legitimate birth certificate and Obanas old passports but you can not produce them. Now who is the LOON?
[…] Snippets from Ned Ryun, president of American Majority; (2/12/10)‘On Birfers and Truthers,’ – “I see that Erick Erickson of RedState has made it clear that RedState is not the place for birfers or truthers. Neither is American Majority. I second Erick’s comments that birfers and truthers have no place among us, nor do they have a place in the tea party movement… …more HERE. […]
For many years I was digusted at the Republicans in the Senate that did not vote guilty at Clinton’s impeachment trial—until I realized that perhaps some of them did not vote “guilty”, because they realized who would take the reigns of power if Clinton was removed from office: ALGORE. Perhaps they chose the lesser of two evils. As stated above, if Obama is removed from office by his birth ineligiblity, that would either leave “That’s-just-Joe” Biden, or possible Pelosi to reign. I think the DEFINING focus of the Tea Party movement MUST BE to influence the vote of elected politicians in Washington—today—and to influence who is elected (locally and nationally) in 2010 and 2012. In order to take America back from the Progressives currently in power, it WILL take the votes of “moderate-independents” who consider birthers and truthers to be “conspiracy nuts.” Because of that viewpoint, outspoken birthers and truthers detract from the “perception” that the Tea Party movement speaks for the MAJORITY of Americans.
Answer one question please and stop attacking those you call birthers. Why has obama spend nearly 2 million dollars and hired a multitude of lawyers to hide his records. You won’t answer that because you can’t or won’t. Instead you attack Americans asking a legitimate question. The fact that you ignore the real question makes me suspicious of your motives.
What the hell is a birfer? Who are you and who is the American Majority to suggest that “birfers” (sic) and “Truthers” have no place in the Tea Party Movement?!!! I will have you know that the original Tea Party Movement was led by a fringe radical named Samuel Adams. I will also let you know that the Tea Party is not a PAC, but rather an organic grassroots movement of angry Americans from all walks of life and political associations. The Tea Party does not belong to Sarah Palin or the Republican party…it does not belong to anyone other than We the People. We are sending our wake up call to DC. I personally will send it to you and the Republican party, you may dupe some of us, but we are mad as hell and we’re not gonna take it anymore! You are no better than the Democrats because you all work for the same self-serving elite. Militias are and will always be the first and last defense of this great nation and usurpers like your organization will always be the fly in the ointment.
For Liberty!!!!! For the Republic!!!
I say the mainstreem republicans who blew their majority and lost touch with the American people should stay the heck away from the tea party. They are just trying to hijack it anyway. As far as the mocking and ridiculing of the “birthers” I think that is really pathetic. I know so many people in East Texas, fireman, police officers, teachers, professionals, etc. that simply DO NOT BELIEVE OBAMA IS ELIGABLE!! At the very least, it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out that he is hiding something. I’m not saying he wasn’t born in the USA, I am saying there is a reason why he will not release his ORIGINAL long form birth certificate. Either he doesn’t have one, or there is information on it that he does not want the public to see (so much for transparency). Ned Ryun, along with Glen Beck, Bill O’Reilly, and everyone else that has mocked us, needs to GROW A BACKBONE. They apparently are more interested in trying to obtain some cheap mainstream media “cred” at the expense of mocking and riduculing the MILLIONS of us out there who are smart enough to know something isn’t right. Oh and Mr. Ryun, when you say “don’t give me ‘we want to defend the Constitution'” I say to you Sir, why hell yes we want to defend the Constituion and exactly what is wrong with that?? Do you think that we are so hell bent on getting rid of Obama that we don’t really care about the Constitution? Let me tell you something sir, I’m a tax paying law abiding veteran of the armed forces. I’ve got family memebers who were tortured in wars and suffered things me and you couldn’t even imagine. They believe Obama isn’t telling the truth either and believe me, they are some very proud patriots and they ARE in the belief that they are standing up for the Constitution. So why don’t you grow a back bone and stop ridiculing your fellow Americans. This reminds me of the town hall health care meetings where Arlen Spector and other liberals completely trashed their fellow American citizens. The media and even White House officials did the same thing. Absolutely appalling, to have the representatitives of the federal government talk about their own people that way. You are doing something very similar.
[…] American Majority, a group that trains tea party activists and others around the country, has done much the same […]
You said, “Have fun with your freedom of speech in the political wilderness.” “Those of us who are serious about positive change in this country have far more important issues to deal with, and we are adamantly opposed to you being associated in any way with the tea party movement.”
To that I say, “Birthers” are seeking positive change by doing everything they can to ensure that the Constitution’s natural born citizen clause is enforced. They are not, sir, doing it as a fun exercize in free speech, as you suggested.
The President of the United States is one of the three branches of government. He is the Executive branch. The nation speaks to all people through one voice, the President’s. The President can make treaties, grant pardons, sign and veto legislation, appoint a Cabinet, as well as Supreme Court Justices. In addition to these duties, the President knows the nation’s most important and secure secrets, and as the Commander in Chief of the military, has the military’s nuclear launch codes at the ready, and who can arguably, either take steps to weaken the nation, or even destroy it. In the words of Vice President Dick Cheney, “The president of the United States now for 50 years is followed at all times, 24 hours a day, by a military aide carrying a football that contains the nuclear codes that he would use and be authorized to use in the event of a nuclear attack on the United States. He could launch the kind of devastating attack the world has never seen. He doesn’t have to check with anybody. He doesn’t have to call the Congress. He doesn’t have to check with the courts. He has that authority because of the nature of the world we live in.” That said, I applaud the birthers for recognizing the importance of having a president who meets the Constitution’s natural born citizen requirement.
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